It’s just a different Sequence… or if you prefer… Pattern.
K000S000
K000S000
is the same as
K0000000 | K0000000
S0000000 | S0000000 <-2 bars… which is just “1 bar” half timed.
and you can do the same to double time a sequence/pattern… You would just zoom in to it… and put more notes in the same 1 bar space.
As far as I can logic out… the only thing you might need to change if you have it as a plugin is the shuffle timing… It may or may not throw off the general idea…
Does this clarify the workflow? I get that I am literally clinically diagnosed as crazy… But I don’t see why this isn’t double timing or half timing a pattern… No… it’s not plugin… I can’t see how this doesn’t work though.
What? I don’t understand what you’re writing.
What is K000S000?
K = Kick
S = Snare
0 = A pad on the Pyramid that has no note in it.
| = A Pipe denoting that there is another entire bar after it…
1 Like
I was under the impression the goal was, for example, to be able to highlight Note Events in step mode, or an active track, and do a 2nd+SomeButton combo and all the selected Note Events would have the Note Lengths and start times modulated to double or half.
1 Like
okay
so i have my K000S000 pattern …
What are you suggesting to do to make half or double time?
If i understand you correctly you’re suggesting to ad or remove notes?
1 Like
But I think that would make it so that an 808 for example would have a longer or shorter decay… and not how many notes would or wouldn’t be in the pattern… It’s not about note length… it’s about how many notes are or are not in the same space.
I think the idea is emulating the Ableton clip function. I think it’s a significant technique for some workflows.
1 Like
That sounds complicated, but would be better than nothing.
Have you have ever used an elektron device?
There you can set for every pattern an individual tempo-scale: x1,x2,/4,/8. You just choose that and the pattern runs faster or slower with the given factor
If you have a simple one bar pattern…
That is
K000S000
K000S000
and you want to half time it…
You make your pattern 2 bars…
Instead of
K000S000
K000S000
it would be
K0000000 | K0000000
S0000000 | S0000000
To double time something… you would zoom in and have twice as many notes in the same space.
Double timing something or half timing something is just a function of having more or less notes than your base pattern in the same space.
So you’re saying i manually have to set/erase the notes?
Thats exactly what i wanted to avoid .
Imagine you have complex sequence with polyphony , overlapping notes , different velocities etc… probably you played that on the keyboard. Thats a real complicated task then.
Are you making fun of me?
2 Likes
To begin with… I’m explaining the process in the simplest terms so you can extrapolate and apply it where you like…
I said… No, it’s not a plugin. I’m sure there exists case example… But in my experience… double timing or half timing something is usually focused on the percussion and the other elements sit in relation to that…
Am I making fun of you? No.
I can’t imagine that I have a polyphonic example with overlapping notes because as far as I can remember… I can not think of a musical example that works that way… The only other person to comment on something similar said “It works for basslines too”… and most basslines are functionally monophonic with perhaps polyphonic harmonic frosting…
That’s my understanding of what is more “under the hood” so to speak.
When you say "double time " or “half time”, it must translate to the real world. “Notes” in MIDI, if ai understand correctly, are a Note On Event of 3 bytes and a Note Off Event of 3 bytes. The time in between is the length of the Note.
So, its not that a “Note” contains the timing info, the timing is based on the sequential nature of the data and where these events occur in a sequence of Clock msgs. Also, the Note On Event does not carry data of how long the Note is.
So, yeah…its a bit more complex because that is the nature of MIDI. I think.
Daily.
Elektron is not the standard for MIDI sequencing.
Yeah. Its not majik. When you “choose” a setting or function, that has to translate to a real world application based on the nature of MIDI Note Events.
So, Im under the impression its not just a “put a button to do this thing” - someone has to program it to make the button do that which you imagine
Not intending to be snark or flippant, but this is an example of why i wanted to look into WiFi SDCards. If i wanted to use this kind of feature, id only have to open the .mid in Ableton, click the button to make it half or double, save the clip to the WiFi SDcard, then reopen the Pyramid project.
Unlikely as I do not have a keyboard and my music paradigm is based on hand entering notes in wherever they need to be… Yes… It can be tedious… Making music can sometimes be tedious… I don’t know what to tell you.
I get that… I think my point is that not everything that is available on a computer is going to be available on a piece of hardware. Hopefully for obvious reasons…
It’s nice that there is a clip function to make it work in ableton… but the same can be accomplished by just… not trying to think of it as a plugin…
To me it’s just… like writing a letter out long hand and then complaining that you can’t use macros while you are writing in cursive.
1 Like
No but it works perfectly for me.
I just looked at all my sequencers. There is not one wich is not able to change the speed in wich a pattern is played back . Only the Pyramid can’t do this.
Beatstep Pro:
just hold shift and choose from 1/4,1/8 etc
Toraiz Squid:
go to pattern and turn Main-Poti to choose from 0.25 - 2.0 speed
Manikin Schrittmacher:
choose under Gate from a bunch of setting … you go really fast (1/96th) to really slow (one step = 16 bars)
of course someone would need to program it …
2 Likes
I don’t get what you’re discussing here.
Many users want a feature that basically every hardware-sequencer in the industry has.
Your example with the letter is really wrong. I’m not hand-writing a letter on purpose. I’m writing the letter with the computer because i can make the text cursive or whatever.
And i’m using sequencers for music making because they do things like playing a pattern faster or slower.
I’m just curious why this i not implemented in the Pyramid and wish Squarp would do so.
If you don’t need or want such a feature, fine. But leave it up to other people to wish such a standard feature.
2 Likes
Yes, that’s abundantly clear…
I have no opinions on whether I want such a feature or not… I can’t do anything but leave it up to other people who “wish” such a thing was on the Pyramid… Whether or not you believe it is bog standard… that is a perception… It may be more or less true… but it is not a standard… In light of the new information you have provided… If you have other sequencers that can do “the thing” why are you not using them to do “the thing” and utilizing the Pyramid where it already can do other things."?
Well if i still don’t know it… No.
Just to summarize:
- Some people ask for a feature.
- It turns out it’s not possible but it would be great to have.
- you say you don’t get why we want such a feature, while it’s already possible
- it turns out you were not right, as it’s not possible
- now i’m discussing with you about this feature and i don’t understand what your point is.
Are you saying we shouldn’t ask for features that doesn’t exist? “Deal with it”.
That would be an great addition to the discussion.
because they all have different weak points… the Pyramid is for example great for realtime-recording longer parts. But this feature could even be more useful if it would be possible to playback that recorded data faster or slower.
The other sequencers are not suitable for realtime recording long parts, but are able to playback data at different speeds.
1 Like
To what? Have a button or a plugin that does this? I never said outright that it was possible or not possible to have it be a function within the code. I am not a Squarp developer… I do not know how much space remains or whether it would be a simple or a difficult thing to do… If you want to say “You’re wrong” fine… That is your perception… Is it possible to push a button or introduce a plugin to the chain that would allow you to do it in the way that you want it done… Currently, I don’t believe so.
Is it possible to write sequences on the Pyramid that are half or double time of the song that you are writing? Yes, fundamentally yes…
Is it theoretically possible? Absolutely? Was it implied as a feature in the media before you purchased the device? Debatable.
I’m not saying you should or shouldn’t continue asking for this “feature”. I am saying that this is a very long thread…
My point to put it very bluntly is…
The time you spend wanting a feature to exist or work the way you want it to on the device and then explaining what you want and why you want it to work the way you want it to… Could very well be spent just writing out the sequences the way you want them to be.
Yes, they all have weak points and strong points… You’re like halfway to my point… Have the sequencers cover for each others weak points.
Yes, it’s abundantly clear a lot of people want this to be something implemented that is time saving. I’m simply saying.
Sure, it’s unfortunate that we do not have this as a plugin… But no… it does not mean you can’t achieve the same effect by writing the song.
Can you do it in a Live performance? Maybe not?
Can you write the song in such a way that it already includes half/double time patterns? Well… Yeah.
The board is telling me that I’ve already become more than 20% of the thread… I’m walking away from the discussion. Good luck.