Encoder switch issue (pre June 2022 units)

Hapax
101

That’s weird. I’ve not had any issues with the buttons at all. Is it just the ‘clicky’ buttons or the main grid ones as well? I know you say you’re pressing them the same as you do on other gear, but is that a light press or a hard press?

I’ve just gone through all the buttons on mine with a light tap and they all clicked in ok. There were a couple of the grid ones which didn’t go in, but think I was too light on it. All of the clicky ones around the side go in straight away.

Sounds like you definitely need to go to Squarp, though, if you’re having all these issues. Fingers crossed it is something easy to resolve.

1 Like
102

ok, found my stumbling stone:

press long works, press short not.
i for my one have “long + hard” somehow coupled, as well as “short + soft”.

i REALY had issues with the sequenzer/trrigger pads sometimes after the start, since i used to press these too hard sometimes.
So something within me switched over to watch that i´d not press anything hard i´d guess.

Nevertheless, my “projectA” button problem was not there first,
and while doing (previous) tests was only the A button not working, but B did.
( which is strange, looking now back to that )

i wanted to reply here earlier today, and while writing i made another test.
fact is: i pressed over 20 times !..until the A button was working.
BUT: i investigated then further, and came to the conclusion… that i must guess, it was all just me !..my failure, …inconsistent pressure/time
nevertheless, its somehow strange how things changed for me.
the Hapax is the only such gear i use right now. so i´m not switching forth and back between similar gear.

whenever i had this type of problems with other gear in the past ( worn out MPC1K for example) was something…worn out, or malfunctioning ( encoders)

i´m not daily on my Hapax, and often would just use it to play allready programmed CC/CV modulations. So theres that too.

Its me !..and yet, not just (somehow)

sorry, for too long answer ! / was just for completness sake

103

Have you tried adjusting the ‘hold time’ setting in Misc settings? That might help with this.

104

No, i was not aware that this exists. / or not aware what it was for, at first days.
did this came new with the last update ?

tryed ! no, it changes nothing ( or just very slightly. hard to tell )
Thanks for the pointer anyway.

105

Do you get a ‘click’ on the A and B project buttons? I’ve just had a look at mine and the click does seem to be the key to when the button in engaged or not. For the record, both of mine respond identically from my perception.

It is possible that you’ve somehow worn out the buttons (or maybe they were defective?) but I would find that unlikely, especially this early in the lifetime of the machine. I have completely worn out a lot of rubber contacts on gear before, which is one reason I was so happy about the clicky switches, which I’m guessing will be a lot hardier.

If there is some variation, would it be possible to video it to show us?

106

they click, yes.
worn out is not possible !
defective ? no, not possible.

it seems to be a thing vs. me, how i press,
especially that i might press different,…dependend where i´m coming from.

And NOT sitting that often on the Hapax to develop a refined feel.
refined vs. different types of buttons within the Hapax.
respectivly would i just use existing projects, and would just reprogramm modulation lines.

just made some more tests. i save you the details, but i think i´m developing now a feel for this whole “thing”.

nothing broke. definitly.
its me and some “picky” buttons i´d say :wink:
( not each sort of buttons the same way picky / need to adapt to it)

sorry for causing troubles. and thanks for the headups folks !

107

click speeds (and to some extent pressure required for contact), can be a bit subjective… (**)
the hardware/firmware will use a kind of ‘window’ for these, (*)
(and this will be different for buttons, pads and encoders)
but because we all have naturally have slightly different tendencies, for some we will fall into this window and not notice anything , but other users might be a tad faster/slower and fall outside of it, and so it feels less predictable.

the good news is this is largely a function of the firmware, so can be fine tuned, and often is for products during early firmware revisions.

SO… the important thing here is to give FEEDBACK to Squarp… this will help then refine and improve the feel for more users, either by widening/moving the ‘window’ a bit, or (if necessary) allow this to be more user customisable (like we have for Pad Hold)

so, if the ‘feel’ is good for you use the contact form and let them know, they can then work with you to get see if the feel can be improved.

note: the only time I would ‘worry’ is if some buttons/encoders/pad feel significantly different from others of the same type (e.g. pads, encoders and switches will vary) , there will be some variation (hardware tolerances etc)

again, if this is the case … or any other suspect hardware issue, your first stop should be to contact Squarp directly via contact form, and work through the issue to see if its really a hardware issue that needs resolving or if its a possible firmware issue.

(*) there are a few reasons for this window, and without seeing the code - Im not going to speculate on exactly how wide this window can be.
e.g. Squarp might not be UX like long press, short press currently, but it doesn’t mean they dont want to leave this option open for future UI improvements (esp when the simple button shortcuts are ‘used up’)

(**) to be clear, here we aren’t referring to the encoder click issue, which is the main subject of this topic… which is a hardware related, but can be worked around… as detailed in the first post of this topic.

1 Like
108

thats good to know ! thanks for responding Mark.

i think i have sorted this, “my issue”, out.
i understand now, - if some button does not respond-, what i have to look for vs. my fingers and how to press.,
( i´m not enough on the Hapax, respectivly would often just reuse allready existing patterns, so that i´ve not developed some sensibility quickly enough / yet, i do not like the top row of the buttons too much in general ( ie. track/mute/ project) / but again: its about to develope some more sensible feel for this all, which helps alots, or sorts things out completly )

2 Likes
109

Had my first encoder switch issue this weekend. I removed the knob, put it back on a little “higher” on the encoder and it seemed to fix the issue.

110

I would expect as people use the hapax more, then we will see this more.
simply because, as you click down, you are pushing the knob further down the shaft.
(albiet by very tiny amounts)

for a while, just pulling it back up with ‘sort it out’ , but over time, it’ll naturally get looser, and so become more frequent, or stop working.
at which point, paper in the end of the cap will fix it for good :wink:

personally, Ive done this paper in knob cap for a few synths over the years, so its a non-issue.
though, in fairness… usually it takes a couple of years to manifest.

anyway if you don’t find the workaround acceptable, you should contact Squarp via the contact form for a solution.

from post above, sounds like Squarp are aware of the issue and are changing the knobs, so can resolve for existing users - and presumably next batch of hapax will use these alternative knob caps.

111

Changed all mine to some Sifam rubbery knobs I had lying around. I didn’t realise how bad the problem was until my workflow had me clicking encoders I previously didn’t. Nearly all of them had issues. The difference in quality of knob build is quite alarming. The Squarp ones are pure cheapy shop quality.

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2 Likes
112

Any news from Squarp about these non functional knobs? Seems like a lot of users has problems with them.

113

The problem is with the knob caps, rather than the pots. Basically they get pushed down too far so that they stop the push bit clicking in. It’s happened on one of my encoders finally the other week, but there is a really easy fix, of putting a bit of paper or tape down the bottom of the knob cap,. then sliding it back on. I did this to all my knobs when it happened (and had to do it on my Pyramid, and my Elektron Rytm for that matter) and it fixes it so it never happens again.

I think it is something they’re looking at (ie, different caps) but dunno what the status is. I think it’s a general problem with push encoders, I tried a wide variety of caps on my Rytm when it first happened, and the only ones that actually seemed to be 100% fine were the ones you get on Sequential synths, but I’ve been unable to find where they source those from or buy any spares (plus wasn’t going to rob the Sequential synth I had at the time of it’s pretty caps)

114

They need to do something. The knobs are not just causing trouble with encoder clicks. They’re also the worst feeling part of the machine. They feel cheep and hollow, they’re too wide, kind of nubby, too slippery to turn, and they’re awkward to press even when not sunk too low.

Just this week one of my encoders was having issues with clicking and, instead of looking for tape or balled paper I put on some Sifam knobs I had left over from a Thunk order (small, unskirted). I’m so upset that I waited so long to get rid of those stock knobs. Putting the Sifams on there not only fixed the clicking problem, them being taller and narrower has made everything about the encoders feel nimbler.

Your mileage may vary. They’re just knobs after all. They’re not going to change your life. But for my 2¢, they’re by far the weakest link of the Hapax.

115

Are knobs all just interchangeable these days, just order 8 knobs and caps from your link and they will fit?

116

The knobs are all ‘D-Shaft’ standard, although you have to make sure you get unskirted ones, otherwise the skirt will push against the face plate stopping you from pushing to click.

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117

Not true. My pic above has skirted sifam’s. They sit perfectly without touching the plate.

118

Fair enough. I’ve got these on my Elektron Sifam Soft Touch Encoder Knobs – Thonk – DIY Synthesizer Kits & Components (the larger size) and the skirt on them was stopping me from pressing in when I tried them on my Hapax.

They look different from the Sifam ones in your photo, though, those look closer to the knobs that were originally on the Pyramid.

119

Also, I know it’s not as aesthetically pleasing, and they come in all sorts of colors so it’s whatever works for you, but I really love being able to see my knobs rather than doing the black-on-black thing.

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I think maybe, just due to the size of the Hapax and all the knobs being on the top, there’s an illusion of having to “reach” for them. Having high-contrast knobs helps with that.

120

Do you have a link to those knobs?

EDIT: I see the links now!