Just to be honest , its a put off

Hapax
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I’m sorry if this sounds like a big moan - I do not want to be that, but

I came to this forum to get more details “mainly” about HAPAX as it looks like a great addition to my modular/outboard midi gear – and I already own other Squarp instruments. I have worked around music tech for years - professionally and invest a lot in music tech- teach it at times as well ++

It’s put me off at times, like almost "go look elsewhere / or posts on here are kind of “like it or lump it” (even put in a polite way). It’s not fair on squarp directly because “I guess” it is not the impression they want to give???

If you want people to continue to invest in your products and brand - you have to listen and build confidence.

If the stores I buy from gave me that impression - I just wouldn’t buy anything else from them. But they don’t and help me find solutions with equipment based and what I need to work - (obviously not all can be 100%).

Maybe squarp should directly reply to some questions on here, rather than letting others try who most likely don’t have the real answers on their plans or other / intentions. Not a dig at users on a forum - but how are users on a forum expected to know? Can only make assumptions

And again, many times have I had direct contact with music tech developers who do give you insight because they want you to be part of their vision - i wont mention who but a number of them gave me insight on next updates - addons / expansions that will be coming etc - saving me buying something i didnt need or will only have to replace later.

I guess if this post is removed or merged – ???

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part of it stems from the fact that when someone posts, it’s not clear if:

  • they are new to hw and looking for “something”,
  • already purchased the Hapax (or whatever) and have a question about functionality,
  • long time hw user looking for something else to add to their current mix,
  • don’t own yet and are looking around to find some hw that meets their requirement/needs

If posters in general were more upfront about their current situation and a bit of background. Of course, apologies to the OP is you did provide that in an early post and I missed it.

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it probably stems from lots of things - and some justifying based on their love for something - but that doesn’t make others wrong etc or their expections wrong.

people are here because they are interested to have something exciting or potential to be in future, maybe it’s probably better to ask questions directly to the developer via email.

I still don’t understand what HAPAX is aimed at — it’s not clear but thats just me, and I will find a use for it (not has a sequencer solution but I’ll work around it…maybe alongside another).

admin - moving people’s posts and embedding comments isn’t a good look- that’s not a community - taking the good with bad and indifferent can be a positive for the future -

it’s not just me - but observations about what can be limiting is fair enough, its how we make decisions on what we use or cant use.

Surly nobobdy expects this item to be a DAW ? that seems far fetched - they just want something that they can use ouside the daw with less limitations / work rounds - some people have bigger sets up - so what is this amied at? the IO suggests bigger sets up potential professional use - but not the amount of patterns or song mode.?

Anyway - its only my thoughts - but i’ll most likley keep out of here as its putting me off buying it, or other squarp.

That happened a lot when technics tried to make a digital turntable (not with me directly) but it just failed and became a book prop in the end.

There were lots of justifcation for limitations and little intention to address them

Other sequencers too

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I merge posts when they are duplicating active topics…
(good forum etiquette is that you look for existing posts before you create your own posts)

which is exactly why I have pointed you (multiple times) to the contact form each time , to get exactly this direct contact

I think the issue here is you believe that the developers should be present on this forum.
In the distant past, they used to be…
however, it presented problems, and they also wanted to be more focused with their time.
so made the conscious decision, to limit their time on the forum, and instead direct users to the contact form for a more ‘managed’ interaction - and use this as a community forum.

and this is something Squarp asked me to help with , when I became a moderator.

when you signed up, the top stickied post, basically says this…
it highlights this is a community forum i.e for users to share ideas and thoughts.

AND that issues/bugs/feature requests etc, and other official communication should go via the contact form.
this is what I have been trying to convey to you… really, nothing more, nothing less.

the community cannot tell you IF the developers are going to add more than 8 patterns, sure we can tell you we’d like it… and that is the sentiment you will find in the topic…
but its only the developers who can tell you IF its going to happen, or when… and that has to be done via the contact form

again, I recognise, that Im sure you’d prefer that it was done here…but again, thats something you have to discuss with the Squarp (guess how?)

anyway, if you have an issue with my moderation…
you can use the contact form to express this, you can also DM moderators, or even reports posts.
(if its about me, then of course, I will not respond to them, but leave for others)

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sorry but you dont know what i beleive do you ???
just saying :slight_smile:

“again, I recognise, that Im sure you’d prefer that it was done here…but again, thats something you have to discuss with the Squarp (guess how?)”

errmm dunno what do i do?

sorry im just being silly :slight_smile: I get it , its what you were asked do

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sorry, but thats my interpretation when you said

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don’t worry

im joking - no big deal :slight_smile:

what im really interested in here - or as sugguested - directly contact Squarp

should i invest into something that isnt going to change much (mainly patterns) - fair enough if not - or do i have to think about having two of them but a convoluted set up etc - or just not bother - all fair enough outcomes.

Not everything can work for all people - if its not really aimed at that or not going to be with updates - then fair enough, a shame but better to look at other options rather than waste just to move on later

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Squarp have a really good reputation for updates… look at the change log for the Pyramid and Hermod.

But, we can never be sure which things are going to be improved or when they might be improved… we simply don’t see the big picture… what bugs do they have on their list, what other features are in the works.
so its not (personally) something Id base my purchase decision on.

but if you contact the devs, they may be able to give you some reassurances…

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i own hermod - plus 2 ramples

but they are differnt and i know exactly what they are for - what they can or cant be used for , but HAPAX isnt clear only to the extent of what it is now which does have some limitations (might be cool for some for live etc or not an issue , but wil be for many)

Just dont want to get into the TORAIZ SQUID territory that missed some key things out - again a shame as it very good in lots of ways too.

ive mentioed mpc a bit that has some annoying parts but its savour is its amazing at most other things - slow / clunky on song arrangemnt side- but fantasic at everything else – and relativily cheap for what it is…look what you get .

Its just a different approach to informing supporters of your brand / products intentions…some are very open and public …so maybe some arnt …is what it is.

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honestly, I can, unfortunately, say its not really about wanting to be ‘open and public’ - most of us (devs) want this, and take this approach when we start out…

there’s really two sides to this

first, is simply, we all know how easy it is to spend too much time on social media… and small companies don’t have dedicated resources for this.
… and most users would prefer devs crack on an write code :wink:

but also there is the unfortunate reality that a few users will spoil the interaction - with unrealistic expectations, which then turn into demands etc. as a dev, you then find you can’t always ‘reason with them’… and frankly, its time consuming, and draining… esp. whilst also remaining professional and polite.

so in bigger companies, developers are told not lease directly, and smaller companies just find out for themselves that a hands off approach works better.
and it’s a real shame as we ALL lose out…

it may sound cynical, but Ive had it personally a few times, and seen it many more times with other developers … its almost not a case of IF it’ll happen, rather when :frowning:

so yeah, I really wish it wasn’t the case… but its an unfortunate side effect of the internet giving everyone a voice … and some ‘abusing’ that right.

there are additional factors, like ‘expectation management’ which every modern software projects is careful of, and this is easier if you are careful with comms lines.

I know its sounds a bit naff, in something we often see as a small niche/community… but you’d be surprised, at how some react, when they down get what they want… so you have to be professional.

EDIT: just to be clear, Im not talking on Squarp’s behalf…
rather my own personal experience as a developer (in multiple fields , including music tech) and as someone who works with a few music tech devs

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just wanna jump in here and say I do think it would be nice if there was just a little more transparency from Squarp. don’t really need them interacting here on the forum, but it would be cool to have like some roadmap for Hapax firmware, even if it was very vague.

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I get all of that

But without being rude, most people dont care or interested in tech struggles

I do appreciate it , and happy to support smaller ops and understand…sometimes you just have to wait.

I managed big corporate networks pervious…no one cared what i had to consider …just it needs to work well…its harsh but they pay .

On the other side . …

A developer is asking people to invest into to their vision and products… and hapax isnt cheap for what it can do right now.

So why should we invest with no insight? Its ok if your not limited right now , but others will be.

So whats the reason to buy? Pay? If you are one of many who find patterns or song arranger limited etc

This has also been pointed out on major reviews as well …youtube reviews etc …not just forums user’s.

If it was commen knowledge that some % would be addressed…then it provides confidence in buying …

not everyone is a pro musician and they have to make compromises to purchase some of this stuff…give them a reason why they should.

Its not all impatience either … its providing reassurance.

And i have seen many developers do it and .lmany times - some give beta out for those who want to test early etc. …and again small operations.

One sequencer developer i know of…is a 1 man operation and he does this … and he’s building a unique belief in himself and his products.

If we were to be harsh and inconsiderate… its not a buyer issue … to worry about dev ops struggles …

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Yes yes

Others do it …yes

Because it feels like …buy our stuff and we dangle a carrot :carrot:

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Thats the point … its not about now

Its some reassurance in what you invest into.
And if that points , it never will be for you…fair enough no harm done.

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that I know full well… its something you learn pretty early as a developer :wink:

rather my only point, is to give a different perspective… that non-devs might not be aware of.
but, you are, of course, welcome to ignore it…

but its why I advise, users to talk to squarp directly, this is how you build a relationship,
which over time, you’ll get much more from than on a public forum.

as for roadmaps, sure, but its again a tricky balance…expectation management.
if you put out things too vague, some will demand more (dates, specifics)
… easy to say, harder to pull off… whilst having any ‘real value’

but again, if you talk to squarp perhasp they might be willing to do this ?! who knows?

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I bought a Behringer wing desk …at the time it would have been great to use dante.

They said its in our plans but not yet… and the desk is capable of it…ok great i will buy it and wait for that addon

Took a while but now I have dante … thats all people ask asking for

The big one is …can hapax add more patterns …simple yes or no please … it’s not a demand to have it right now…

It sounds like the song arranger can’t be changed …is that right? Maybe not a deal breaker

Can you potentially merge two projects into 1 to allow more tacks … .maybe not a deal breaker but a simple answer would help.

Why should I spend what will be around £1150 pounds in a few weeks with no insight?? Based on what it is now? Because other options can do very similar and cost less

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I know what you are saying its not straightforward

Ii I was squarp and I was reading these posts i would have contributed already on behalf of the company.

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it’s not me choosing to ignore DEV’s perspective

its a harsh reality - not based on me

simple tho- don’t promise what you can’t do - and keep it specific to what you will do,

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NGL, I feel like your approach to moderation in this forum is ineffective! Over and over in these topics I see you shutting down discussions and discourse only for you to reply with a load of words about your opinions. I don’t even read your replies anymore! I don’t think the forum users need someone to tell them to stop talking about it and just submit a request form over and over again! It’s a forum! I wish you would say less! I personally don’t enjoy your opinion in every topic. If anything this forum needs an advocate for the reasonable requests of the users/investors of squarp gear! Take this how you will but I hope you find it constructive! I personally keep coming to this forum with the hopes of finding an update or a discussion about features and limitations of hapax but it’s always the same thing “submit a request and stop talking about it”!

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Just to be honest, Squarp is pretty dang responsive. Use the contact form. It works for me every single time and Squarp answers my questions whenever I have them.

Sharing a roadmap is pretty hard to do as users often view a roadmap as a promise of things to come and get outraged when the timetable shifts or a feature doesn’t happen. I can’t speak for Squarp, but on the projects I work on we’re pretty careful about what features we mention to avoid upsetting folks.

Side note: @thetechnobear does a great job keeping this forum readable and not filled with dozens of duplicative topics which I very much appreciate.

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