MPC 4000 Sync Latency help


#1

Hi all,

I’m trying to tighten up the sync between my Pyramid and MPC 4000.

There seems to be pretty bad delay in the midi sync compared to the midi note to the mpc.

The Pyramid is the master.

I have connected midi out B into the MIDI in on the MPC

I’ve programmed a 4x4 click on both machines. So the Pyramid is sending note info playing a rim shot on the MPC and it’s sending sync to the MPC which is playing an internal sequence of a similar rim shot both quantized with no swing .

The timing of the notes is way out, you can see in the pic below.

Is this normal?

Thanks so much for any help!


#2

At first I was confused by your pic… It would be easier to see if you would pan each signal respectively left and right.
Which one is early? Which one is late?

How many ms are we talking about?


#3

Yes sorry if it’s confusing.

The MPC 's sync is late (the louder waveform) by about 20 ms. Sounds like a ghost note.

The midi note (the small waveform) that is sent from the Pyramid to the MPC is bang on with the metronome from the Pyramid.

This to me says the MPC 4000 midi slave is not great, but there could be something else going on.

Thanks for your help.


#4

Apologies if you’ve already tried these but I’m just trying to help:

Is the Pyramid sending Sync AND start/stop from Midi B?
Do you have anything else in your MIDI chain or network that might be disrupting things? (Unplug everything except the Pyramid and MPC until you’ve got the clocking sorted)
Is the MPC set to receive MIDI clock and not MTC or SMPTE or similar?
Is the MPC filtering any incoming MIDI that might be clock or transport related?
Can you clock the MPC from another device without any problems?

jim


#5

Hi Jim, thanks for the help! Actually yes I’ve tried all the suggestions and settings above. Actually now that I think about though when the MPC sycs to Ableton I have to adjust the midi latency a bit. Maybe MPC is just average in slave mode.


#6

Latency/jitter is to be expected (to an extent) when you are syncing hardware to a DAW. But it shouldn’t happen with hardware connected over regular MIDI.

Have you tried listening to the MPC metronome output rather than triggering a sample? If the metronome is tight with the Pyramid clock but the sample triggering isn’t then your problem may not be clock/sync related.

jim


#7

Yes, the metronome on the MPC is also consistently late with a metronome from the pyramid. I’ve tried sending clock on one midi cable and triggers on the other to separate the midi data and it’s still late.


#8

There’s this test from innerclock (link below) it seems a very tight internal sync and pretty average external. Maybe somone else can decode this better than me.

Akai MPC-4000

Internal Sync - Sequencer

Audio Out Jitter - 1 samples (0.02ms)
MIDI TX Jitter - 3 samples (0.06ms)

External Sync - Sequencer
Sync Source - Legacy MIDI Clock/Gridlock II

Audio Out Jitter - 29 samples (0.60ms)
MIDI TX Jitter - 29 samples (0.60ms)
Start Lag - TBC


#9

You’re probably not going to notice half a millisecond here and there. If the latency is 20ms as you say I think the problem lies elsewhere. But I’m all out of ideas sorry.

What happens if you slave the Pyramid to the MPC, have you tried that?


#10

Thanks Jim, I really appreciate you trying to help out! Actually when the pyramid is slaved to the MPC it’s really tight. I’m going to look at some master clock options. Most likely a combination of Expert Sleepers box’s to try get everything playing nice.